Trophy Taker Smackdown Pro – AVS Tuning

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This topic contains 14 replies, has 8 contributors, and was last updated by bootheel-boy bootheel boy 11 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • May 8, 2013 at 5:16 pm #577322 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
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    Some have had tuning issues with the AVS system and cable actuated fall away rest. Others have had tuning issues and complained of a mushy wall on the AVS system. Creep Tuning will cure both problems. This post is about installing a limb actuated fall away rest, then tuning the AVS timing, then paper tuning the Monster.

    I received two Trophy Taker Smackdown Pro rests, one for the Z7 Magnum which was installed using up-cable actuation, the second for the Monster AVS which was installed using lower limb actuation.
    Up-cable on the Z7 Mag. Inserted through the cable with an overhand knot and melted end of the tag. This holds securely, but I’ll serve it in for added security.
    TTsmackdown AVS 014

    Lower limb actuation on the Monster split limb. I first installed the limb clamp very loosely and drew the bow to verify the cam cleared the clamp. Then I followed instructions to snug down the clamp then add 1/4 turn. The clamp has rubber coating so it will not mar the limb.
    TTsmackdown AVS 013

    At this point leave plenty of tag hanging from each end of the actuation cord and don’t tighten down the cord clamp bolts. Install the rest on the riser. The launcher will be in the full up position allowing the center shot and nock height to be adjusted. I started with the centershot at 13/16″ (52/64ths) or about the 4th index mark on the rests centershot index and with the nock height about 1/4″ high or about the 3rd index mark on the rests elevation index. Here the actuation cord is clamped down on the lower limb but left loose on the rests cord clamp.
    TTsmackdown AVS 016

    With the rest set, I now pull down on the actuation cord to get the launcher in the down position and tighten the rests cord clamp  bolt to hold the launcher down … leaving an ample tag on the actuation cord to do this will become an obvious help.
    TTsmackdown AVS 017

    The Trophy Taker Smackdown Pro is quite easy to install, is very quiet, and comes with the launcher covered with a silencing material. It  also has an extra silencing pad for the launcher and a stick-on arrow holder if desired. When making adjustments to centershot or rest height, just loosen the actuation cord bolt, make the adjustments, pull down on the cord tag and re-clamp … very easy.

    Here is the Monster, setup for 3D … PSE Carbon Rod Stab w/ Ktech V-bar, Sure-Loc Black Eagle sight, Trophy Taker Smackdown Pro.
    TTsmackdown AVS 001

    The upper and lower Cams were timed with the cables centered in the timing holes.

    TTsmackdown AVS 003
    TTsmackdown AVS 004

    The bow was paper tuned as close as possible, but a mushy back wall was noted. The Bow was then Creep Tuned, first three shots pulling hard into the wall, then three shots pulling as little as necessary to hold at full draw.
    TTsmackdown AVS 006

    The ‘creep’ shots were about 2″ above the hard against the wall shots. This meant turns could be added to the lower cam  cable or turns could be removed from the upper cam cable. I decided to add one turn to the lower cam and re-do the three hard against the wall shots and the three ‘creep’ shots. Actually, with the one turn added to the lower cam cable there was now a very solid wall and no creep allowed, but I carefully letoff tension as much as possible while remaining at full draw. Both groups now hit at the same elevation.
    TTsmackdown AVS 007

    Now, it was time to get serious about paper tuning. First shot at 5′ was a right tear, so I moved the arrow rest out  … that is correct … OUT from the riser about one index mark on the rest. The second shot was a bullet hole at 5′. The third shot at 10′ was a nock high, right tear, so I first corrected the nock height by raising the rest about 1/2 index mark. The fourth shot at 10′ was a small right tear, so again I moved the rest OUT, but by a very small amount, less than 1/4th of an index mark. The fifth shot at 10′ was a bullet hole.
    TTsmackdown AVS 008

    Next, I verified my 20 yd zero and shot for group. A couple of click of the Sure-Loc and I should be centered.
    TTsmackdown AVS 009

    Now, I’m ready to Group Tune at 40 yds when the weather improves.

    … hope this helps. {#emotions_dlg.mathews_peace}

    May 8, 2013 at 7:55 pm #577330 Back to Top REPORT
    3dmodeler
    3dmodeler

    Joined: 3/12/2011
    Excellent post, thank you.
    May 9, 2013 at 9:33 am #577377 Back to Top REPORT
    bow-drawn
    Bow Drawn

    Age: 62
    Joined: 11/14/2007
    View My Bows
    Great post Gjarcher!

    I put one these on my switchback this winter and I used the bottom limb clamp. It took some work getting it tuned and definitely more time spent than some others I’ve tried. My CS went to 13/16″ with it compare to the 11/16″ where it was before. I also had some vane contact with it on the top curve of the FC bar so I bent it up a 1/8″ and my clearance now is fine. And I’m using Blazer vanes. I put a monkey tail on the down cable to help quiet the noise and it helped some. But this rest so far isn’t one of the best I’ve used.

    May 9, 2013 at 11:17 am #577392 Back to Top REPORT
    rickym
    RickyM


    Joined: 8/4/2004
    great post bud!
    May 9, 2013 at 11:36 am #577394 Back to Top REPORT
    njbowman
    NJBowman

    Joined: 2/27/2010
    View My Bows
    Great post! I was thinking of trying the smack down rest. One question about the AVS system, is there any way to adjust cam lean with this system? My top cam is leaning a little and I have had a bear of a time trying to get it to paper tune. Thanks
    May 9, 2013 at 11:51 am #577395 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
    View My Bows
    The AVS system uses a free floating yoke, so there is no way to adjust cam lean using the yoke. I asked my dealer if I eliminated the “Washer” and went with a split yoke so I could adjust cam lean, he told me that would void the warranty.

    Both my cams lean slightly, and an arrow laid on each cam crosses at the nock point on the string. As long as the crossover point is at the nock point, there doesn’t seem to be any tuning/accuracy issues.

    Take it to your dealer and have it inspected. If the cam lean is out of limits then perhaps there is a problem with the cam or the limb matching … and covered under warranty.

    May 9, 2013 at 2:05 pm #577401 Back to Top REPORT
    bow-drawn
    Bow Drawn

    Age: 62
    Joined: 11/14/2007
    View My Bows

    The AVS system uses a free floating yoke, so there is no way to adjust cam lean using the yoke. I asked my dealer if I eliminated the “Washer” and went with a split yoke so I could adjust cam lean, he told me that would void the warranty. 

    Both my cams lean slightly, and an arrow laid on each cam crosses at the nock point on the string. As long as the crossover point is at the nock point, there doesn’t seem to be any tuning/accuracy issues.

    Take it to your dealer and have it inspected. If the cam lean is out of limits then perhaps there is a problem with the cam or the limb matching … and covered under warranty.

    I’ve done that with a straight edge on my MR7 cams and they do the same thing, cross at the nock. To me they seem to be like the solo cam yoke tuning only double and that works fine.

    May 9, 2013 at 3:39 pm #577412 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
    View My Bows
    Out of curiosity, I measured to see precisely how much clearance there was. With the launcher covered with the silencing material in the full up position, there is 5/32″ clearance with an ICS diameter shaft and the New Blazer Vane (.568″ height).

    I don’t know if there have been changes in the containment ring, which is rubber coated for silence, or if some containment rings have been bent in shipping. Regardless, the TT Smackdown Pro rests available now have plenty of clearance.

    Click on image to enlarge.
    TT Smackdown-AVS 001
    May 9, 2013 at 7:47 pm #577428 Back to Top REPORT
    vash
    vash

    Joined: 5/30/2010
    Excellent! I watched that guy on that show “nock on” do the lower limb one. He never mentioned what type of rest it was. Super confusing. Thanks.
    May 10, 2013 at 9:44 am #577491 Back to Top REPORT
    bow-drawn
    Bow Drawn

    Age: 62
    Joined: 11/14/2007
    View My Bows

    Out of curiosity, I measured to see precisely how much clearance there was. With the launcher covered with the silencing material in thefull up position, there is 5/32″ clearance with an ICS diameter shaft and the New Blazer Vane (.568″ height). 

    I don’t know if there have been changes in the containment ring, which is rubber coated for silence, or if some containment rings have been bent in shipping. Regardless, the TT Smackdown Pro rests available now have plenty of clearance.

    Click on image to enlarge.
    TT Smackdown-AVS 001

    Gjarcher looking at your picture my containment arch was farther down and was forcing the rubber flapper side piece inward toward the launcher until I bent the containment arch up. Mine now looks more like yours  with about that same clearance and that makes me wonder too about how it got that way. The other thing I noticed is your rest shelf in relationship the bow’s rest shelf being below it. On my Switchback I have the rest back from the bow’s shelf about 3/8″ and the two shelves are about level with the rest slightly (1/16″) lower. This would put my shaft centered with the berger hole. My guess the Monster has to be lower to center it properly with this rest.

    May 10, 2013 at 11:34 am #577512 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
    View My Bows
    I would expect there to be a small difference in berger hole height above the shelf from one bow model to another. The rest contacts the grip, and the launcher when fully down is level with the shelf, unlike most rests whose launcher sits about 1/8″ above the self and often makes noise hitting the shelf when fired. The TT Smackdown also has rubber cushions to silence the launcher arm when it drops.

    I mounted the rest so the mounting arm was level, which is the way all rests should be mounted, and pushed the rest up as close to the riser as possible, then mark with pencil along the top of the mounting arm. I do this so if it moves or were to come loose in the field I could put the rest back in position and retighten it without changing the bow tune.

    BTW, don’t use my index marks for setting up your bow unless you are using a tapered Fatshaft. The rest is mounted much lower than it would be for an ICS shaft (.294″~.300″ o.d.) since I’m shooting an AD .395 Mag-Lite with a .395 o.d front end tapered to a 9.32″ nock end.

    TTsmackdown AVS 001

    TTsmackdown AVS 002

    May 10, 2013 at 12:48 pm #577516 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
    View My Bows
    Here is a view of the TT Smackdown Pro tuned for an ACC 3-71 (.298″ o.d.) parallel shaft.
    TTsmackdown AVS 003
    May 10, 2013 at 5:18 pm #577535 Back to Top REPORT
    mdbowman
    mdbowman

    Joined: 7/15/2006
    Have you found that the Monster line works better with a lower versus  top, cable, or string activated? Or is it just a matter of personal preference?
    May 10, 2013 at 6:24 pm #577538 Back to Top REPORT
    gjarcher
    gjarcher

    Age: 70
    Joined: 10/3/2006
    Location: Colorado
    View My Bows
    Using a cable activated fall away rest effectively short cables one of the cams. When I used down- cable activated rests, I routinely added as much as three twists to the get the top cam in synch at full draw. Even with the up-cable activation, like the SH Whammy rest, it affected the cam synch just prior to arrow leaving the string. However, with Creep Tuning I could get good arrow flight and grouping. I have never had a rest that is bowstring activated, but that too seems it would affect the nock point location, etc. Creep Tuning corrects for hand/grip pressure, location, etc. and a variety of other factors that are off the center of pull for 2-cam systems.

    I believe the AVS or any other Hybrid/2-cam system will tune easier if not better when using a fall away rest that is  limb activated. Limb activation will disturb the cam synch and nock travel the least. JMHO{#emotions_dlg.mathews_peace}

    Of course, there is always the choice to use a shoot through or blade rest, then there is nothing to disturb the cam synch or nock travel. {#emotions_dlg.mathews_whistle}

    May 10, 2013 at 11:28 pm #577560 Back to Top REPORT
    bootheel-boy
    bootheel boy

    Joined: 7/21/2006
    Location: S.E. Missouri
    Thanks once again for taking your time to help us out GJArcher.   The information you provide is always appreciated.  While I personally am not changing from my ripcord code red I can see this thread helping many in the future. {#emotions_dlg.mathews_peace}
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